Thread: Re: [Ogoglio-developers] Sketchup (1) - Avatars (2) - Spatial sound (3)

 Hi Trevor and All,

As you Trevor previously said, one of the most important aspects of the coming open virtual worlds environments is .. the AVATARS .. it's about the people .. their image etc..

I would like to enter here some brainstorming output I got from relatives yesterday: a general opinion seems to be that one of the (very few!!) best, future-oriented "feature" of SL (in comparison to Croquet, Wonderland and .. Ogoglio,...) is .. their current, existing "big" avatar "system": diverse, rich, flexible, off-the-shelf, nice-looking, customizable, pick & click features, etc... amazing apparently! Of course the rest of the SL platform is not always so nice but it is not the topic in this message ... the key fact is that the SL viewer is open source now.
  
 Suppose that a company would like to build a front-end which could use the same avatar system for accessing both Ogoglio spaces and SL servers (legacy but ... there to stay for some time.. even for slightly different markets ..). For the explained above reason one alternative could be to merge the avatar part of the SL open source client with the existing open source Ogoglio avatar component !
  
  What do you think ?
  Is it feasible ?
  Does it makes sense ?
Are there any alternatives, like .. a similar capability to come as part of the core Ogoglio development, or alternatively some other open source tools which could be used ?

 Thanks again!
 -michel
ps: of course one knows that Ogoglio allows us to use our own custom OBJ files for avatar shape, while SL doesn't .....

Sure - I admit that I was playing a little bit the role of the "devil's adv=
ocate"

For the success of Ogoglio on the marketplace (web - users), the Avatars sy=
stem seems to be one of major big piece to make happen -- and yes they need=
 to get clothes, shoes, .. what I read will be happening.

At the difference of other aspects of the Ogoglio platform, avatars are not=
 described (yet?) in any documentation - one just learns that they are BVH-=
based for animation.
Looking at the files, typical Ogoglio avatars have currently BHV's (for var=
ious types of animations), an OBJ for the body (and a SMAP), a source blend=
er file and a number of JPEGs each containing all textures plugged onto the=
 various areas of the avatar. For avatars with editable parts (like Mike) t=
here's several OBJ's and blender sources, as well as several MORPH files.

Today with Blender, (QA)Vimator, DAZ, BVHacker, Art-of-Illusion,... it is p=
ossible to play and convert with OBJ's or/and BVH's ... but what are the re=
quirements in Ogoglio for matching the BVH with the OBJ? What are the possi=
ble Ogoglio constraints to make the skeleton fit into the mesh ? Can we use=
d just standard recommendations like explained in the Blender forums and si=
milar ?

=C2=A0Please could you say a few words about this ?

Thank you,
-michel
=20
=20
=20

> Message du 02/02/08 22:04
> De : "Trevor F. Smith"=20
> A : ogo...@li...
> Copie =C3=A0 :=20
> Objet : Re: [Ogoglio-developers] Sketchup (1) - Avatars (2) - Spatial sou=
nd(3)
>=20
> On Feb 1, 2008 1:24 PM, Michel DENIS  wrote:
> >  Suppose that a company would like to build a front-end which could use=
 the
> > same avatar system for accessing both Ogoglio spaces and SL servers (le=
gacy
> ...
> >  Is it feasible ?
>=20
> No.  SL's client is huge (almost 200MB on disk).  It's size and
> complexity make it unfit for web use and, frankly, it has proven to be
> quite unusable for the majority of people who try it.
>=20
> >  Does it makes sense ?
>=20
> No.  SL's avatars are designed to be used in the fat client world
> where it's ok to render a couple of frames per minute and to take 10
> minutes to download a small crowd.
>=20
> They have a fur system in there!
>=20
> > Are there any alternatives, like .. a similar capability to come as par=
t of
> > the core Ogoglio development, or alternatively some other open source t=
ools
> > which could be used ?
>=20
> As with all open source projects, features arrive when someone steps
> up and builds them.  Transmutable is going to contribute a attachment
> and clothing system designed for web users, not virtual world
> enthusiasts.
>=20
> In general, I encourage everyone to look beyond the relatively tiny
> population of Second Life or WoW and towards the massive user
> communities on the web.  Why are the avatar systems like WeeWorld,
> Zwinky, and Gizmoz successful or failing?  Why is Habbo so huge?
>=20
> Those are the interesting questions, not whether we can bring fur and
> bling to Ogoglio.
>=20
> - Trevor
>=20
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>=20
>=20

On Feb 1, 2008 1:24 PM, Michel DENIS <mic...@or...> wrote:
>  Suppose that a company would like to build a front-end which could use the
> same avatar system for accessing both Ogoglio spaces and SL servers (legacy
...
>  Is it feasible ?

No.  SL's client is huge (almost 200MB on disk).  It's size and
complexity make it unfit for web use and, frankly, it has proven to be
quite unusable for the majority of people who try it.

>  Does it makes sense ?

No.  SL's avatars are designed to be used in the fat client world
where it's ok to render a couple of frames per minute and to take 10
minutes to download a small crowd.

They have a fur system in there!

> Are there any alternatives, like .. a similar capability to come as part of
> the core Ogoglio development, or alternatively some other open source tools
> which could be used ?

As with all open source projects, features arrive when someone steps
up and builds them.  Transmutable is going to contribute a attachment
and clothing system designed for web users, not virtual world
enthusiasts.

In general, I encourage everyone to look beyond the relatively tiny
population of Second Life or WoW and towards the massive user
communities on the web.  Why are the avatar systems like WeeWorld,
Zwinky, and Gizmoz successful or failing?  Why is Habbo so huge?

Those are the interesting questions, not whether we can bring fur and
bling to Ogoglio.

- Trevor

> They have a fur system in there!
>

and fur is murder -
especially on system performance!

a friend who writes casual games on Facebook noted recently that his
app isn't yet popular enough to reach the top rankings on FB, but
still draws more daily users than all of Second Life.

that put things into perspective for me.